What
NOTE: Admins, please move this thread to the suitable category, I posted it here cause I had no idea where this would fit.
SECOND NOTE: It took me two hours to type it all, it's very long, and I suggest you read all of it before replying, otherwise skip to the end and respond only to the question, without responding to my opinions if you opt not to read them.
I know for a fact that most of you are already annoyed by reading the title of the topic, but if you wanna continue reading this post and respond to it with the intent of being productive, then you've gotta calm down and allow yourself to finish reading before making any impulsive reactions.
The amount of hatred I see towards people who prefer virgin partners is absolutely ridiculous. Case in point:
I originally thought I would do the same with multiple images, but I might as well save time and move on with this.
Here's my stance on this entire topic:
I have a lot of criteria and if a girl conflicts one of those, I won't even consider her as someone I can be with. One of those criteria, is virginity. And when I say this in online chatrooms, such as 7Cups or PeoplesProblems, I get amazing responses. I even start off with "this topic might make you angry, so I do not wanna trigger you or waste your time", and they usually say "I promise I won't get angry". However, once I tell them that I want my future partner to be a virgin, they explore with rage. One of them ended the conversation with "yes I am calling you names, f**k off dude" and blocked me. And that was absolutely hilarious, cause I didn't abuse that person even once, but that person lost their shit in an instant over absolutely nothing!
And yes, there are ones who do not get angry, but tell me that I am wrong, or a bad person, and use assumptions to support their statements. I am gonna debunk those assumptions.
1. So even though you have had sex before, you wanna be the first one to f*** her?! That's hypocritical!
Okay, I'm gonna ignore the entire "hypocritical" comment and clarify this one. I am an 18 year old virgin, I haven't even had a relationship yet. I haven't been romantically or sexually intimate with anyone, and I am extremely sensitive. When I love, or even like someone, I can't stand the thought of them ever loving someone else, let alone doing stuff with someone else like kissing and having sex. Yes, it's natural, and everyone has the right to do what they want to do with their body. However, my feelings, are also very much natural and I can't control them.
2. Ah, you're one of those religious types!
Absolutely not! I am an atheist, and there's a whole new set of assumptions that comes when I say that I am an atheist, like "you are egoistic", or "you are a rebel", or "so you loathe religions", none of which is true (well, maybe the rebel part, although there's no clear definition as to what rebel means in this context).
The point is, I am not religious, and my feelings and decisions aren't based on some beliefs, or a book like the Bible. They are purely a result of who I am and how I feel. And yes, I would never get emotionally or sexually involved with a very spiritual girl, and that is not only because she is likely to be praying in a church/mosque/temple if I ever end up getting hospitalized in the future due to reasons, rather than being by my side, holding my hand and comforting me with her presence. It is also because such a girl is likely to never fully love me due to this difference, and god is likely to always come first for her. However, I would not mind if my future girlfriend/wife belongs to a religion and isn't overly spiritual.
Anyways, I am sorry for rambling away from the entire virginity issue. Here's the next assumption-based response I usually get.
3. We women are not objects whose value decreases after every use.
Of course, I never even remotely implied that. I have been a part of 45 women's right movements in my life, and considering that I'm 18 years old, it's not a big deal, but sure as hell not a minor achievement. Usually, when people say "think about a person", a "man" comes to their minds. In some cases, including mine, a "man" comes to my mind, and a "woman" comes to my mind. It's randomized, but it's equal. So to all the feminists that might target me and other people like me with this stuff, keep in mind, I am not a feminist, but sure as hell not a misogynist. I consider both genders to be equally powerful, equally smart and I don't see many differences between both genders.
So back to the main point, I do not consider women or men as objects. Both of beautiful genders, and it's beyond my capacity to imagine how either genders can be objectified.
4. I see. You are afraid that if your partner is a non-virgin, you won't measure up to her ex-partners.
No! That is definitely not the case. I know that even though I haven't had sex yet (and probably never will), I will at least be average during my first time, if not a pro. There's no actual, scientific explanation for why I feel this way. It's just that some things, including sex, aren't always necessarily taught to people. Some people just turn out to be good, naturally. I have heard at least a few people say that their best lover was a virgin before the two got it on. So there's proof that during my first time, if that indeed ever happens, it is possible that I might rock her world.
Regardless of that, I am not afraid of her comparing me to her exes, but the fact that she actually had exes will kill me.
5. Your pride is so weak, it'll crumble if you lose it to a virgin?! Pathetic!
What are you even talking about? It has nothing to do with my pride or my ego. I am not saying I don't have a pride or an ego, I'm just saying that it's to big to get hurt by an issue like that. :p
But jokes apart, it's just gonna be my heart that's gonna be hurt. I have always imagined relationships, love and sex as fairytales, which means that I must feel special.
Here's a scenario:
Imagine taking someone you like on a hiking trip. And every time you try to start a conversation during the hiking, they tell you "shut up" or say stuff like "I wanna go home", or "there's no Wi-Fi here, gimme your phone and let me text my friends". And after the entire hiking is ruined, once you two reach the end, at a cliff, and look at the sunset, they stand far away from you as you two look at that beautiful view, or they refuse to hold hands while looking at the sunset, or they drown their face into their phone as you look at the sunset all by yourself and tears run down your face. Now one thing I forgot to tell you, it's the very first time you've been hiking over there, and it's the first time you've looked at that view, while they've done both of those things.
Would it be as special as you would intend it to be? Chances are, no.
Now imagine the same scenario, except neither of you have been hiking at that place, or seen that view. You both have lovely, deep conversations while hiking, help each other every time you get tired, take breaks and share food with each other, and finally, enjoy the beautiful sunset at the cliff while sharing a magical kiss.
Which one sounds better? Obviously, the second scenario.
Sorry for rambling away into this, but my point is, the reason why I wanna be my future girlfriend's/wife's first crush, first love, first boyfriend, first kiss, first sexual partner, first husband, and pretty much first at everything romantic and sexual, is because it would make both of us feel warm, special, enchanted.
6. You self-righteous, entitled piece of s**t!
Yeah sure, I am all of that. Except I am none of that. :p
I never claimed that the world owes me a relationship, let alone a relationship with a virgin. I know that I am not entitled to it, and I know that I didn't do anyone a favor by not doing any of that so far. In fact, I'm completely fine with being alone for life if the girl of my dreams doesn't show up. Remember, I didn't place any sort of demand whatsoever! I just stated my opinions and feelings, and that doesn't make me unfair or a bad person in any manner. But of course, you would rather respond with "you have freedom of speech, so do I, and I think you're an a*****e", to which I would applaud and say "I am proud of you".
7. So you believe that people shouldn't have sex till marriage.
Nope, absolutely not. I don't believe "people" should do anything. I don't care about "people", and they can do what they want to. My opinion is strictly limited to myself, and my future significant other. I do not look down on anyone for having sex, whether they are married, or in a relationship, or just hooking up. I have plenty of non-virgin friends, male and female, and I don't lecture them for having done it like you may be imagining in your head.
That being said, even I myself don't believe in "no sex before marriage". In fact, I would most definitely want to have sex with my future partner before we get married, although I wouldn't push her into it.
8. So if you're in love with a non-virgin, simply have sex with a prostitute or someone else, just to get even. Then you can't say "I'm a virgin and she's not", and that will solve everything.
Okay, that's a little weird. Sex isn't about numbers or keeping score. It's something that I intend to share with only person, and I want her to share it with only me.
And keeping all of that aside, I can't ever fall in love with a non-virgin, at least not after knowing she's not a virgin (and I already sense people quoting this part and in response, saying I am a bad person). And also, I can never have sex with a prostitute, or any other non-virgin girl. I directly connect my virginity with love, which is why, I want my first experience to be special. I don't wanna be a virgin with a non-virgin partner, I don't wanna be a non-virgin with a virgin partner, I wanna be either a virgin with a virgin partner, or a virgin without a partner.
9. So get a virgin girl who has given a few BJs to guys, so that at least she will be good at that. Trust me, you will feel good.
You are very off-base for thinking that. Here's society's mainstream definition of female virginity which most people believe in: "If a girl's hymen in her vagina is intact, she is a virgin".
Even that is scientifically proven to be wrong, since the hymen can break very easily without any sexual activity involved, and the blood may come out during menstruation, which is why most girls won't even realize that their hymen broke. Plus, a hymen can be surgically reconstructed.
But no, according to me, that's not the proper definition of a virgin.
According to me, if a girl has had a penis inside her vagina, done anal sex, BJs, let someone else finger her, eat her out, play with her breasts, or even shown herself naked to another person, she's not a virgin.
Even though a person who has kissed is a virgin, I won't ever consider being with someone who has kissed before because it would kill me.
10. So you would prefer an evil virgin over a good experienced girl as your girlfriend?! That's insane!
No. I have many criteria, not just virginity, meaning that if a girl is a virgin, it won't automatically make me like her or fall in love with her. I won't consider her as my future partner if she conflicts any of my other criteria, some of which are, 'she should be afraid of losing me', 'I should be her number one priority', 'she should not be an actress or a model' etc.
Keep in mind, those are criteria, meaning they are my requirements, not expectations. That's not something I can compromise on, they are directly linked to how I feel, and I can't ever imagine my future partner conflicting any of those, as the only feeling I would get after that would be pain!
END OF DEBUNKING
So, my opinions and everything is pretty much covered up in the debunked assumptions. If you wanna respond to my opinions, feel free. However, keep a calm and rational mind while reading the post and replying to it, do not let your impulses cloud your judgement. My intentions are to find out why people show immediate and huge amounts of hatred towards people who say they want or prefer to have a virgin partner.
Please do not respond with more assumptions, keep everything clear and simple. Don't assume anything, if you think "so and so thing" about me is true, please ask me first before actually believing that it is actually true and responding according to it. If you wanna ask questions, feel free. If you wanna counter my opinions, feel free. If you wanna provide solutions, feel free.
I intend to keep this a rational discussion in which we are all indulging to derive information and people's opinions.
And if you chose to skip to the end without reading my opinions, my final questions to you are:
1. Do you prefer a virgin or non-virgin partner?
2. Do you hate people who prefer to have a virgin partner? If so, why?
3. What's your stance on this entire issue?
4. Why do you think people hate those who prefer to have a virgin partner?
Admins, I am sorry about the amount of graphic content involved, I am new to the 7Cups forums. Please censor whichever parts you think are inappropriate, but please do not remove the post, as I am really curious about this and I believe retaining this information would do a lot of good for people like me.
@JaxLawrence hey, sorry if this isn't helpful and I know you really don't wanna know my opinion but i read the whole thing and i get where your coming from but a lot of people are encouraged to have a boyfriend/girlfriend so a lot of people have kissed someone else and I get why you want someone who hasn't been with anyone else and everything you said and I cant say everything I wanna say because I have to go but I thought I'd right it now but just remember that someone who's been with someone else (not necessarily sexually) didn't work out with the other person and means nothing to them anymore and there's always a special first kiss in each relationship whether its your first relationship or the last, sorry if I offend you in anyway :)
@AllTimeSleepingHorizon You did not offend me at all. That's your opinion, and I am glad you are able to think that way. Whatever you wanna say, you can say it whenever you get the time to.
Thank you for reading the entire thing and giving me your response.
@JaxLawrence I completely forgot what else I was going to write but im glad I didn't offend you I tend to with a lot of people but I do agree with a lot you said and im sorry that people get the wrong views about and say stuff which shouldn't really be said but to answer some of the questions you put at the bottom(I know I read the whole thing but oh well) 1. I guess a virgin partner mainly because I am too but if I found the right person I dont think I'd mind (casually cant remember the other questions so I might do them if you wanted to know) but if you ever wanna talk i have a listener account that I dont remember the name of but I can find out if you did want to talk (forgetful person problems)
@AllTimeSleepingHorizon Thank you for answering that question. It's good that you won't mind their non-virginity if you really love that person, because that means that unlike people like me, you won't necessarily go through mental torture once you find out about that. It's certainly a kind of advantage, and if I would've had that, I probably wouldn't have been single now.
@JaxLawrence "My opinion is strictly limited to myself" ..... from Point 7 in your original post
If you really beleive this, why do you care about my opinion?
Let's face it - you're unsure of your position, and you're looking for validation.
I'm sure of my position and I don't need validation. Have a nice day.
@10ship Thanks for the response. However, when I said "my opinion is strictly related to myself", I merely meant that I don't believe others should share the same opinions. I don't want or need any validation or approval, I am just curious and I started this thread to derive information from people. The information you gave me helps me see how people who react impulsively, much like yourself, fail to take the time to ask questions before replying and choose to reply with assumptions. So yeah, this was helpful.
Thank you for your contribution.
@JaxLawrence
1. don't care as long they are enthusiastic.
2. don't care.
3. whatever floats your boat. Its not logical decision anyway.
4. don't care why someone hates someone. Ask them for their reasons.
@lucidpanic That was short and simple. Thank you for your response. If you have anything more to add, feel free to do so. If not, that's fine too, I can conclude that your opinion is a rational, stable one with no exploding rage or irrational assumptions. :P
@JaxLawrence
yeah, i dont see any worth to rationaly discuss an emotional (as you admit multiple times) issue.
If you want to examine this motion objectively, then it has some evolutionary sense given the paternal uncertainity. Although this is no controlable issue in western world anymore. One could argue that choosing this apprach could lessen the chances for a sucessfully long time relationship.
@lucidpanic If the "motion" you are referring to, is people losing their virginity at an early age, then yes, it isn't controlable in places like the United States. And yes, it's true that people with criteria like mine are likely to end up alone because as we age, less girls within our age bracket will be without a past. I will admit, it would be the best thing in the world to have the perfect girl in my life, but the chances of her existence are slimmer than the word slim itself. As I have stated in my post a few times, I am completely okay with ending up alone.
If I misunderstood what you meant by "motion, please help me clarify what you meant. Thank you for your response.
@JaxLawrence
first i dont see any point to the discussion,as you dont seek reason to change your mind. Not that i see any need to do so. Because it is not a issue of mind, but one of the emotions.
Secundo the only thing i added, that from evolutionary point of view , males that prefered to know and were able to control the sexual experience of their mating partners had greater chances to rise their own children. That what i meant by the paternal uncertainity. A woman pretty much never will have to doubt if her children are hers. For men it is wholy different situation. So it makes sense that this preference would evolve in some men.
If you want to examine if this prefernce is a boon or more a obstruction for a sucessfull partnership in the modern western world, thats another topic.
I could imagine that people would be more .. approachable to discuss this, if you did not causaualy use phrases that could be interpreted as judgements.
@lucidpanic Okay, let's break that down.
1. You used evolutionary psychology to explain why some straight men might prefer a virgin partners. Although that's definitely not the reason in my case (not even subconsciously), that is true in the case of many other guys. Good contribution right there, respect!
2. I don't even want kids, mostly because I am certain I won't be able to handle all of those responsibilities, and might end up being a bad father. But that's a wholely different thing, I just thought I would share, now that you mentioned that point.
3. No, I absolutely don't wanna discuss whether the preference is a boon or a curse, mainly because that's subjective, and I believe that everyone is entitled to preferences. I was just curious as to why people show immense anger and disgust towards those who have this preference.
4. Could you elaborate which of my statements you're talking about that you feel are like judgements?
Thank you for contributing, your opinions are very valuable.
@JaxLawrence I agree with you, it is nice to have someone compatible and this is big issue for compatibility with a partner. But on this site saying things like that is against leftist groupthink so they will always tell you F*** off if you disagree at all. and that you hate women's freedom it's ridicolous. its not entitled, its having a preference. women can have preference but men can't in 2017 I guess. that's the new society rule sadly.
@Tyler5641 Thanks for taking the time to type your opinion. While yes, it's true that opinions that the majority doesn't agree with ends up being certain death for whoever holds it (and not just on this site, but in real life as well), it is also true that there are still people out there with rational and logical thought processes. Everyone has rights, but unfortunately, wrongs come with those rights. I have a preference, but hating it and parading against it is still everyone else's right, which may or may not affect my life, directly or indirectly. Affecting others' lives is where one should draw the line to the entire "rights" topic.
@JaxLawrence Being against any feminist idea seems to get you called entitled self righteous little boy nowadays.
@Tyler5641 Once again, thank you for taking the time to post your opinion here. Personally, I don't feel it's wrong at all whether you agree or don't agree with something. Even if that means you agree that murder is okay. You can believe whatever you want to, as a human being. The space inside your head, your mind, your imagination space, is all your's. It sure does become wrong when you use that thinking in real life and affect other people's lives.
So, in that sense, other people can think "JaxLawrence is a puny man" or "He's got no respect for women" and all that, to any extent they want to. I couldn't care less, and it wouldn't be wrong for them to think or feel that way. But, if they go around chanting my name on the streets, rallying and convincing people to boycott the products I'm selling, then that affects my life, and that makes it wrong. The whole idea about life is to live and let live, people really don't seem to get that.
Anyway, I pretty much rambled away, again. I guess that's just the type of person I am.
I don't know if this be short and simple but this is what I say you have your standards and things like that yeah so you will only go for a girl if she's a virgin but what happens when you meet a girl who isn't bit you and her have loads in common your heart wants her your having feelings for her but your brain says she ain't a V you can't aways have high stakes and standards even if she isn't a virgin her first time would still rock with you and won't be the same with her ex's now days there's less and less virgins yeah I get it your first time with her first time but your mind will be over taken with your heart so you want a girl that's a V bit not want a girl that has tjat special connection with you its not always about eww she's not a virgin I want a virgin like a child not stopping till they get a lolly my fiancée and I he was a virgin and I wasn't but our first time together was so amazing I felt like I was floating on the clouds and to this day its still like that my man is nothing like my ex every new relationship with both virgins or one is a virgin and other not or both ain't Vs it's still the first time for them both together and its amazing some people are not fussed and some are but even non virgins with a virgin or both non virgins it's still magical together each timey partner and I make love it's so special and him and I have a great connection together sexual and just by being in each others Aura
It's still special and great either way
@BrightRedFlower2322 Thanks for taking the time to post your reply. I admit, I had a few difficulties trying to comprehend what you've typed, but I've got it all figured out now. You're basically saying that for you, virginity or non-virginity is absolutely irrelevant, and every sexual experience with the one you love is heavenly and far above your past sexual experiences with other people. I'm sure a lot of other people feel that way as well. I am not one of them, but I am happy for you, and I'm glad that you didn't respond impulsively. You expressed your opinions without displaying any instability, so great job, and once again, thanks. This information might just help somebody reading this.
You like what you like. If someone has a problem with that, they have a problem not you.
For eg coming from a religious family I can easily understand the sentiments of men here. They don't want women to walk around in revealing clothes, they definetly want virgins as their partners and if they are not virgins it's a deal breaker. Now why do I understand them? Let me shed the light.
First things first. If a man likes women to be covered, he has full right to like woman like that. Because this is his preference. Even if you are a woman or a feminist you can't bash this man for not liking you. He is not forcing you to wear clothes, he is saying 'do whatever you want, but I don't like women who wear revealing clothes'.
Now for the other part. Men from religious families have it very tough. They stay virgins till they marry, mostly at least. And masturbation is frowned upon so you can imagine the amount of frustration, guilt and addiction they have to suffer over this. But nonetheless even when their hormones are at their peak, they control themselves by fasting or whatever means. So the least of which they expect from their future partner is for them to be a virgin. So they can say 'It was all worth it, because I am sharing it with the one I was fated to be with'.
Even if you are a non religious person, you are still entitled to hold your own preferences which may be backed by your own reasons. You don't need to justify them to anyone.
@indigoBeing3282 Thank you for taking the time to share your opinions. You followed a very rational structure right there and displayed no impulsive responses. You pretty much said stuff that I was trying to convey up there in the post, so yeah, finding common ground does feel amazing. What you just said about the revealing clothes thing is on point. People can do what they want as long as it doesn't affect anyone else's life. By saying I want a virgin partner, I am not harming anyone or anything. I'm merely saying it, not bringing out a search team and kidnapping a virgin girl, and forcing her to be my partner. But a lot of people respond to me as if I did something along those lines, and that's just terribly sad. Rationality, has apparently, almost gone to heIl. But I'm glad to see that you've maintained a rational stance, and your opinion hasn't caused any inconvenience to anyone whatsoever. That's the way it should be, so great job, and once again, thanks.
