Sharing Circle Introduction/Conclusion Survey Results
Hi everyone,
Thank you for participating in the “Let it be” survey. We had over 100 responses to the survey, and a high proportion of those had additional comments which were really helpful in understanding the reasons behind why people voted the way they did. It means a lot to know that so many people care so much about Sharing Circle.
Information that came from the survey:
- More members than listeners responded.
- More participants than hosts responded.
- Out of the three options (keep “Love, give me grace...” the same, remove it completely, replace it with something else) keeping it the same was the most popular (50%), followed by replacing it with something different (35.6%) then getting rid of it completely (14.4%).
In recognition of the fact that the largest group wanted to keep it the same, we will be keeping this section in the script. However, as a fairly large proportion also wanted to change it, we will be trialling the following change to the preceding paragraph:
“Please imagine taking the hand of any person present or take a deep breath. At the end, if comfortable, please say “let it be”. Alternatively you may say another mantra that has significance for you, or simply say "let it be" as a mantra in its own right.”
Thank you again for your input in this matter, and see you around in Sharing Circle soon :)
Tagging hosts active in the last 2 months:
@AnnaTess @CheeryMango @ASilentObserver
@bountifulreeds24 @@jovialButterfly6752 @Youshine @Bu123 @Sunisshiningandsoareyou @Gozzil @richuyulin @@calmMango9611 @AnnaTess @DonaldDraper @InquireWithin @BuzzingHoneyBee @DreamTouch @Whisperwillow2020 @PatienceImpatiens @Noah88 @WintersCuteFox @Lou73 @WinterCuteFox @Girly2017 @bubbleBalsam6602 @Tiahuaer @ForestFern12 @Containedchaos @GoingSafari @Asdari @OPtimisticFlute57 @Kiwii7 @listnerlex @TealSpring5935 @CozySlippers @Empath42 @jovialButterfly6752 @riccchuyulin @pvroom @Banjothebudgie @shiningRainbows65 @perhapssomeone @fairmindedWater1140 @UnbotheredSwan @sleepingGrapefruit @jovalButterfly6752 @pioneeringpark9589 @musicalHarmony @sallymae3459 @Solitary3102 @AncoraImparo @creativeSoul5974 @CalmRosebud @SolaceCares @courageousheart96 @iampapaya @lavalavau @Peecee @AuntieMymble @imalittlerebel @AriadneLove @Bipedhuman666 @Jasminerice @kindLemonade @MagicalSarah @sunnylistener @stelladodo @fantasticFlower5111 @kindLemonade @journeytobeauthenticallyme @Star996 @SpiceyHeart @kindLemonadd @journeytobeingauthenticallyme @DigitalKnight @FairyPrinceSasha @MilaTheListener @AvaFoxy @unique73 @ZenArashi @SummerBreeze00 @zenArashi @Hylenia90 @YellowRose27 @Peachtalker3416 @TakeMyHand13 @xichimi @lueurspace @Kingdomevibe @Evelynerose @bluePonds2373 @bluePond2373 @Tealbear2472 @kindLemonde @PeacefulMindswithKvac @LivinginDiscomfort123 @SupportMatters @@joyfulwillow8216 @theriverissinging @TheFriendlyMartian @Username
@Gozzil
Yay! So glad we got to hear everyone's thoughts and come together to make a decision.
@AnnaTess Agreed, Anna! Thank you to everyone who took part in the survey! :)
@Gozzil
Thank you so much for sharing the final results of the survey with us, Gozzil! <3
Let it 🐝!
I am disappointed. When it comes to being supporitve and inclusive, especially at a time when issues such as colonism, genocide are being discussed and people are examing past and generational traumas 7 cups iseems to me to be siding with colonialism. Not just the sharing circles, the paternilistic colonialistic views are seen here too - https://www.7cups.com/experts/spirituality-for-mental-health
The article gets attributed to 7 Cups Community, Global Support
This isn't the type of thing this community member supports, and it bothers me that I am part of a group it's being attributed to.
I really dispair that at this time, days after the bodies of 215 children were found who died to due genocide an article uses an image of a dream catcher, a well known object connected to the spirituality of some First Nations peoples, and then it's followed by a christian viewpoint of spirituality under the guise of it being spirituality overall. To me that really smacks of some of the viewpoints of residential schools - the christian way of spirituality is the right way and others should take that path.
I stand by my earlier forum post Why majority rules isn't inclusive
I am saddened, at a time when there's more awareness of the systemic abuses, but a pope refuses to apologize for the atrocities done 7 cups chooses to amplify christian voices.
I thought when the statement about Black Livers Matters was made by admins, we were choosing to move towards equality, not defaulting to what the dominant culture wants.
@AffyAvo A thread that has connection to this issue as well - colonialsm fits into this topic too. https://www.7cups.com/forum/YoungPeopleofColor_129/YPOCForumDiscussionsandQA_703/FalseAttributions_206383/
The video is something that has been used in discussions.
I wonder, given that there is still a significant proportion, albeit a minority one, that would like something more clearly secular, if there could not be at least some "Secular Sharing Circles" where the religious aspects would be avoided entirely?
I know personally as a member of the LGBTQ+ community there is often a very painful relationship with religion, where even seemingly passive exposure can make me feel uncomfortable and unwelcome. I have actually avoided sharing circles because I find them extremely uncomfortable on multiple levels.
While I respect that a majority who responded was satisfied with the current format, minority voices also matter and deserve consideration beyond what essentially feels like "we heard you, but we are going to keep doing what we were already doing even though it excluded you because that's what most people want."
@ExpressedEmotions I support that, especially with it being Pride Month!
I thinkt he survey was biased too - if people haven't felt comfortable in the sharing circles, but would if some changes were made, how many of them have just ignored sharing circle information at this point, including the survey?
I've pointed out some specific things recently, but going back to my overall reasoning for dropping the religious aspects to the sharing circles - it's to take away a barrier to participation, for a variety of reasons!
@AffyAvo
Yes I had been concerned with the biased nature of who would even respond to such a survey to begin with. I almost didn't but I've essentially been taught to 'speak up' even when it may not be particularly important to me directly because there are people who it is important to who may not feel able to speak up for themselves or won't be allowed to do so.
As you say it creates barriers to participation which sadly are often 'invisible' to those who don't encounter them personally. I also find that the 'forced participation in religious aspects' makes much of the rest feel false or disingenuine to me. Sort of the entire exercise becomes more of a 'performance' and less genuine. But I find even the "scripted acceptable responses" during sharing circle feel almost like religious affirmations in disguise.
@ExpressedEmotions It seems like such a small change to make a more welcoming environment for all, I am confused by the resistence to taking it out.
As for the scripted responses to you mean the things like one day at a time, sorry to hear that, etc? I don't mind the phrases themselves although I mostly avoid the acronryms, I think I tried them out a few times but didn't feel like a good fit and one of them actually reminds me of a swear. When everyone sticks to those though, I feel like the support aspect gets lost. Like there could be a chat bot throwing out those without any personal connection. I do think a few personalized comments can make a huge difference and that does seem to happen a fair bit when I have been present. I'm not totally sure if the personalized responses are supposed to occur in a sharing circle, although I haven't seen much for discouragement when they happen as long as they aren't judgemental or are a question. The intro does act as a discourgment to them though.
@AffyAvo
Yes I find the repetitive phrases, especially the abbreviated versions, feel like others are disengaged or not really listening. I found it uncomfortable to the extent that I've simply avoided it after a few rather off-putting attempts.
It can certainly be challenging trying to meet the needs of many diverse individuals even in something as simple as an intro, especially as it is often difficult to even simply identify what those needs may be. That's why I thought perhaps having more than one option available (such as alternating a secular and non-secular option) while perhaps a bit more involved would be a way to try to meet a greater diversity of needs here on 7 Cups where those who appreciate the current format can continue with it while those seeking something different would also have an option. Sort of while you can't please everyone, there may be ways to please a larger portion of people simply by giving them alternatives.
I did sort of try to come up with something at one point that was more secular as an intro of sorts but it would likely be too "cold" for some. Basically trying not to force any virtual hugs or contact which can be difficult for some individuals even in a virtual context and reminding everyone that they are allowed to have their own needs and they don't have to match anyone else's. Something along the lines of "Welcome all to our sharing circle. Let's take a moment and set an intention for our interaction today, we are here both to seek the support of others in allowing us to share, and to offer support to those needing to share. Thank you for giving us all the opportunity to both listen and share. How each of us expresses our support is different, just as how each of us receives that support is also unique, we simply ask that this be an open and accepting space where we respect our differences while trying to foster community. In order to ensure each individual needing to share is free to do so, we ask that expressions of empathy or understanding are simple, brief, and without judgement or questions to preserve the individual's flow of thoughts and their room to share."
But that's enough rambling out of me, thank you for listening and sharing your thoughts.
@ExpressedEmotions Oh, I think that's a great way to start them off!
@Gozzil
Hey Goz,
Thank you for sharing this information. I appreciate that the totals were included as well.
~ Sher
Hi @Gozzil,
Thank you for sharing the results from the survey! Love how the total percentages were included as well. Glad you got to hear everyone's opinion on this matter.
"[K]eeping it the same was the most popular (50%), followed by replacing it with something different (35.6%) then getting rid of it completely (14.4%).
Half of the respondents wanted to change it or remove it. 35.6%+14.4%=50%. That means there's no majority in keeping it, it's a tie and it's super-controversial.
Why keep it then? Nobody will react to no religion, but half of the member will react to religion. And again this conflicts with your own policies in group chat - no religious talk.
I think you need to reconsider what these results mean and what actions to take in light of them. The poll clearly shows that this is way too controversial to keep.
That's the whole point of 'no religion' in group chat as well as a general principle there: As inclusive as possible. As little division as possible. I'm baffled that the decision is to keep it, both knowing how it directly clashes with Cups' own principles and predictably seeing how controversial it is.
thank you for the update, but this decision does make me slightly uncomfortable if i’m being honest. i don’t think it’s very right to treat a prayer as something that can be “replaceable”. religion is an extremely important aspect for many, and to have prayer be treated this way is quite disrespectful in my opinion. additionally, some are uncomfortable with using a phrase that is quite similar to a prayer. as a former sharing circle host, i’ve had new members ask if the “let it be” part of the script was a prayer. i replied that it was not a religious prayer, however, i did feel a bit of a lie there as “let it be” seems to be based off of religious prayers. i don’t exactly see how just changing it could hurt anyone. i believe keeping it will only cause more controversy and i do think that the decision/situation could’ve been handled better. but i understand. thank you for the survey anyways and for putting it into consideration.
It is a Christian prayer. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serenity_Prayer
@rrretsuko
"Let it be" is a commonly used religious affirmation similar to "Amen".
my mistake, i’m a catholic so we don’t use that phrase. however, i still stick with my other points of it 1. being uncomfortable for me as i don’t use that sort of prayer 2. of it being uncomfortable for those who are not religious or not christians. i feel that it causes many to not participate in sharing circles
Hey y'all! Just wanted to say we're hearing what people are saying and you're not speaking into the void. As everything is and should be, Sharing Circle is a work in progress, and we will continue listening to the community as we put the work in. Thank you all for taking the time to share your thoughts!
@AnnaTess @Gozzil
Thank you Anna and Gozzil. SC IS a work in progress and the thing is any in group, especially as big as this one, no one will be happy. If it was reversed others would be unhappy it was taken out. No where does it say we need to participate, and no I am not religious at all myself, far from and have been hurt by religion.
However; there is "prayer" found in all aspects of different lives. There are prayers/chants in Wiccan, Native American's, Atheists, Agnostics, songs we listen to every days, etc.
I personally saw Let it be my first time and immediately my mind went to "Let It Be"`by John Lennon....that some can say is religious, but for me and many others, taken it "Whisper Words of Wisdom....Let it Be." It is a good reminder that sometimes we just need to let it be, we do not have answers now, or feel so lost and overwhelmed and tired looking for answers and letting go and letting it be.
I am good with leaving it or taking it out and I know I do not need to participate it in any chants/prayers.
I appreciate everyone is able to have a freedom to voice our opinions here, but let us all remember that Anna and Gozzil are not to blame for this, they did the task by counting and presenting the information to others, so while expressing our own opinions, lets remember to be kind.. <3
@Containedchaos I don't blame Anna and Gozzil for this, it was devleoped and stuck well before they got involved with the sharing circles. I don't blame 1 author for the expert article either, I think there was a degree of insensitivity, not sure of the author's knowledge of the hurt going on now. If it was a forum post though it's not coming from 7 cups as an organization, it's individual. When it's published as an expert article, it's there as part of 7 cups, not just as an individual's viewpoint. I doubt 1 person gets to write and post it there without anyone looking it over. It was also attributed to the community.
I agree that most people engage in some sort of mantra, prayer, chant, etc. at some point. 7 cups isn't a religious site though, so it seems odd to take a prayer associated with one religion and apply it here. Especially considering that discussing religion is against the rules.
I had tried to come up with something that was more inclusive and in line with 7 cups culture. I also kept it short (although I think my starting point may have been too short) so it doesn't drag on for those who aren't comfortable participating in that part. I used the phrase sending beams - is everyone going to be comfortable with that? No. Is it connected to a system that has inflicted abuse on a population? Not that I'm aware of - and if there was negative feedback due to my own ignorance of a problem, I would welcome people speaking up on it. I also feel like overall the scripts are too long when looking at everything included like the rules. That has been changed over time, when they first began it seemed like less than half of the time was actually used for sharing. The prayer itself takes up most of the chat posting area.
Hey Affy. We hear your feedback about the Sharing Circles, but we'd like to reference back to Glen's reply in the original announcement post where he thoroughly explained the clinical health benefits and how there is no particular belief system endorsed (I will paste it here for easy reading):
7 Cups supports people from all walks of life. We are a platform. We want people to feel comfortable here no matter their background or beliefs. We do this now to some extent with sub-communities. The structure or format is the same, but different groups use sub-communities for different reasons. Similarly, with groups, we provide over 125 moderated discussions a week. Some of these are fun, some of these focus on a topic like anxiety and others on skill development like mindfulness.
We have just started the sharing circles which are offered in the tradition of AA/NA/OA. They are helpful for a variety of issues. There is a long history of these groups and the format that has been around since the late 1930s. Moreover, these groups have helped millions of people. The NYT just covered a new review that suggests they are even more helpful than long thought. You can read that article here. Even the little bit of data we have so far on the sharing circles on 7 Cups is compelling. People seem to enjoy them, find them meaningful, and helpful. Finally, groups like sharing circles are routinely offered in health systems around the world and clinics where there is no particular belief system endorsed by the health system. They provide the groups to people that find them helpful. We are following that same process here on 7 Cups. We provide lots and lots AND lots of different resources and supports - we trust people to engage in the ones that they find helpful and avoid the others.
@Heather225 While AA isn't connected to a specific church, it's foundation is Christian and it hasn't moved away from a belief standpoint, it has just tried to be a bit flexible for other religious beliefs.
"AA is not a religion in the formal or legal sense, although the U.S. Supreme Court has held it is religious to the extent that forcing people to attend violates their constitutional freedoms. The Canadian picture is different, and it is playing out in human rights law."
https://nationalpost.com/news/canada/alcoholics-anonymous-universal-status-challenged-in-human-rights-court-for-forcing-belief-in-higher-power
Brian Wood got a settlement for BC based on AA:
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/bc-byron-wood-nurse-12-step-religious-discrimination-settlement-1.5391650
I haven't seen anything to suggest that AA/NA/OA are better than secular based organizations for addiction recovery.. Sharing circles here aren't focused on addiction recovery, so I think clinical evidence for using this model here is even further limited.
People have commented it makes them uncomfortable. To me, it seems like a rather small change to drop the religious aspects, but one that could be very meaningful to some people, would be more inclusive and make some much more comfortable. I don't see much of a downside to removing relgious connotations from the intro/conclusion other than some religious people may not like it. They are always welcome to have their own religious ritual to begin with or end though, it's not like we forbid anyone from doing something like their own private prayer as part of their process.
WHen I made the suggestion to have our own - as 7 cups - intro and conclusion I was also trying to build in points that were covered from the building community course. I think there's something that could be gained from having our own, not just coping AA.
@AnnaTess
Thank you. A lot of us didnt even know about survey and did not fill it in.
I would second the removal of any religious prayers, or even one's that sound like a particular religion in the interest of being inclusive not just of other religions, but also of people who don't believe in any religion.
Inclusivity is not dependent on a survey or 'public opinion', but is a requirement of this platform, same as the rules where members and listeners are not allowed to discuss religion in most rooms.
Sharing circle can have its own poems or prayers without mimicing any christian ones, that would be awesome to have its own poem. However it is a bit worrying if a christian prayer is being used in this.