December 9: Read only Guest Support
Hello all!
As many of you have been following, in this thread, we annonced the closure of the Guest Support room. We are excited to announce that we now have a read-only feature for guests! Any guest who wants in the room will be prompted to create a 7 Cups member account.
Note: The member community is now a read only guest room. The subtext "member / guest" indicates that guests can read the content of the room.
As @Heather explained in this thread:
"We do not wish to completely exclude guests from the rooms and are currently planning a feature that will allow guests to view the conversation in rooms. They will need a member account to actively participate (much like how the forum works), but will still be able to see what is going on and follow support sessions. Many websites do request that users sign up for accounts to use various features. On 7 Cups we do not ask you to provide personal details (e.g. your real name) in order to create an account, so it is absolutely possible to do so and still remain anonymous. Additionally, guests are still able to seek support in 1-1 chats and use the free growth path without an account. "
Over the next few days and weeks, we will continue to experiment with this udpate. This will mean chancing the room names & working with all of you to figure out how to best use the feature. Please follow this thread for updates!
@Laura Impressive ! I hope and pray things work out this way
Before I respond further about this news, I would like to inquire about how obvious it will be when a guest joins a member room? Will it be clear to everyone in the room that there are currently guests in it? Or when they leave?
I think beyond the list of current participants there should be a tab listing all guests who are currently viewing the room.
This news could make a lot of people uncomfortable or afraid in sharing personal issues or stories in a safe space if they have no idea who could be lurking in the room.
Hope to get a reply, thanks!
We have always had this situation where we don't know who is lurking don't we? If someone (member, guest or listener) has been in the room at any point and left, they would be able to come and go in the room without ever participating or even showing as entering the room and simply lurk? We all have been aware of "lurking" that people do all the time and that has been fine. I'm not sure how this changes that situation or if that is needed to change since it has always been the case and has little ill effect on the rooms already.
@beYOUtywithin
I agree that the participating List isn't completely accurate. But I think their is a BIG difference between a few MEMBERS Lurking versus a whole group of ppl, who's motives for being there are unclear. For example: With this new system in place, a entire class of University students writing a paper on Psychology could not only be watching... but taking notes! I hav no desire to be someone's Lab rat. An above Post mentioned some ppl will watch Chats simply for entertainment. I'm sure that'll happen to (Ugh) 7 cups should provide as safe & comfortable an environment as possible. I feel this compromises that
@Laura
I think this is a good start. I've seen things like this implicated on other websites so it's not a bad idea. It lets guests think if they would like to get involved in chat rooms after observing and makes them consider becoming a member to get the full experience. ☺ I find a lot of "guests" already have member accounts anyway so they can use them if they wish to chat in chat rooms, but as long as guests can get support from listeners, the growth path, the feed and forums, that's all that's important and those who come here for support only, will likely agree and still feel supported. I personally don't feel chat rooms are imperrative to getting support here.
@Laura
This is a brilliant idea!! I hope this is able to work, yet if it doesn't it sure is a start. 
Hope it goes along SWIMMINGLY!! 
forcing people to be members.... great!! So officially they are not welcome here....
Everyone is welcome here and everyone can get support if needed.
@AgentMay08
@SilentSerenityy if and only if you're a member....
@AgentMay08
You're a member so you can get all the support you need and so can the guests you're concerned about. All for free.
I am one of those persons who has a (sometimes annoying) habit to give long reply's but I guess there is an exception for every rule...
In this case
This is a well balanced and truly positive solution.
Great job @Laura and everyone else involved in the creation and implementation of this idea!
I think that this is a way for me to deal with my feelings and grief. I believe that talking with people who have no clue who I am but can help me. Is a step in the right direction. I also think that this will help me reach other to other people who have experienced a suicide loss.
@Laura i see where youre going but... i dont think that excluding guests from group chats entirely is a good idea. It makes the guest feel unsupported and unloved by the community. Listening is often not enough for a guest and there isnt really much point just staring at a chat. This is unfairly punishing all guests when only some have done bad things. Some people dont want to make a member account, just get quick and easy one time help and then never come on here again. Is that not the point of guests? I think that this has ruined 7cups for guests. Anyone who is in agreement we can make our voices - those of everyone, INCLUDING GUESTS - heard.
heh I wanted to see what it looked like as a "guest" and its not TOO bad, you can see the chats and see if it looks interesting enough to join and when you go to comment it prompts you to make an account. Just like any other website
@Laura [Unsupportive edited by SilentSerenityy] THIS IS UNFAIR FOR THE GUESTS! BAN ME ALL YOU WANT, I CANT HELP BUT TELL THE TRUTH AND YOU KNOW THAT ITS THE TRUTH! WHY ARE YOU BEING UNFAIR TO GUESTS? [Hate speech targeted at a user edited by SilentSerenityy]
ok now my 'ranty personality' has stepped back from the controls,
1. This is unfair for guests. So you take away their chat, forum, feed and leave them with what? A listener who might not (be able to) help them and a [Unconstructive criticism edited by SilentSerenityy]
Ugh. Sorry.
2. Why the heck did you even do this anyway? Youre banning guests from getting the support they need - just because some guests are being rude. STIGMATIZATION! [Unsupportive comment edited by SilentSerenityy] Not train listeners for anger support and other things, and then take away chats and add useless ones? Seriously?
3. THIS IS A TYPE OF STIGMA AGAINST GUESTS. THIS IS HARMFUL AND UNHELPFUL. Do you hate guests? Want them all to make member accounts? Or maybe its just because you want to say, 'Oh, we have so many new members now! We are the best site ever!' [Unsupportive criticism edited by SilentSerenityy]
4. Guests are guests because they DONT WANT TO MAKE A MEMBER ACCOUNT. do you hear me? They DONT WANT TO. they just want quick stop help, for one simple problem and then done, thats how a lot of guests work. Youre ruining our experience and I quit my listener account because i was so angry at this.
GUESTS DESERVE HELP.
remove my comments, block me, mute me, hell even ban me, but i will not go down without having my voice heard by SOMEONE.
@sympatheticPrune6704
Would you be so kind to enlighten us with any kind of "solution" to the problems you see because this minor change seems to really affect you... Sharing is caring ;-).
I had several conversations with guests today 1-1... They seemed to appreciate my "help" so it seems to me that in some way guests can still get help...
I agree with you when you note that "guests choose to be guests". That's absolutely true, it's a conscious choice. People are neither forced to be a member and nobody is forces to be a guest. Like you say, people can choose to be part of this community, free of charge...
You probably know that 7cups is a community where vollunteers offer a free support service. Personally I am glad to be of service to both members and guests and it's the existence of this community is a gift for many people. I believe this community was founded on a principle of offering emotional support, free of charge. The founders of this community aren't forced to offer this service and while member account remain 100% free to the best of my knowledge you might want to consider that running a website like this (without advertisements) is anything but free.
I do not believe you will be banned because 7cups is a rather supportive community and it's perfectly fine to feel frustrated but if you could explain the facts behind your accusations that would be very helpful.
I feel as if you are representing the guests… Im just giving you my personal opinion because I cannot speak in the name of the listeners or the members. Can you explain what makes you represent the opinion of the guests?
Feel free to reply in whatever way you feel is best but I can assure you do not need to use CAPS to make your point. Did you know that speech dictaction software, the software a person with impaired vision uses to be able to surf the web cannot convert that writing style to speech. Text to speech will read any words you write in caps one letter at a time.
@PoolOfBrokenMemories bruh you dont need to give me a lecture on the goddamn whatevers of vision. The reason i said all that is becuase of my stupid second person, which on this occasion i totally agree with.
Solution? [Unsupportive edited by SilentSerenityy] Bring back the guest support room of course. Get rid of the trolls and praise the do godders. You know, like the moderators are actually supposed to do.
@sympatheticPrune6704
Sorry if I gave the impression I wanted to lecture you. I just wanted to understand your point and now I do. Thank you for the reply.
Seriously can ANYTHING be done to bring the room back because i would very much like it back.
@PoolOfBrokenMemories
@sympatheticPrune6704
I'm not in any position to influence the situation. After reviewing all the information I did already say that as a member of the community I personally support this new approach.
While you are free to use the forum to share your opinion with the community (I guess that's what forums are for) please accept my opinion while I also accept yours. Since we have a different opinion about this topic I believe its better if you contacted me with a PM if you feel the need to talk to me about it. Laura said that this change will be evaluated and I do believe that the community leaders will act in good faith andl take all opinions into consideration.
@sympatheticPrune6704
Well, although that came out wayyy tooo rude... but I totally agree with what you think. I agree 110%.
@sympatheticPrune6704
Firstly, I understand that you're angry but here at 7 Cups, we appreciate comments and feedback that do not have a hateful tone and include attacks against users or the site, so in future, please consider those around you who may be offended by your comments. I recommend reviewing the forum guidelines.
1. Guests still have the forums, feed, self help guides, sub communities and access to listeners and therapists.
2. Limiting guests of their access to the chat rooms is not banning them from support as there is plenty elsewhere here as previously stated and is not what 7 Cups intend to do. In the main thread, Laura has linked to the thread by Heather which explains why all of this has happened.
3. We do not hate guests, we don't hate anyone. Everyone is welcome here. The number of member accounts 7 Cups has is genuinely not important to them and that is not why this change has taken place.
4. We very much know that people prefer to be a guest here (you can have a member account and also come in as a guest if you wanted) and that's okay. If they want quick stop help, they can get plenty from the listeners, sub communities, forums and self help guides and that is more than sufficient for most guests who come here for support. Unfortunately, many don't find the chat rooms supportive for their issue anyway.
Guests do deserve help and that's exactly what they're getting, the only thing that's limited is the chat room. If the chat room is extremely important to them and imperrative to their support, they can make a member account within minutes which is equally as anonymous as a guest account as they can keep their guest name, use a fake e-mail address (though you won't be able to recover your account if you forget your password) and it's all free. I don't see any harm in making a member account in those circumstances.
You have a member account, so you can access the chat rooms! Why do you want to access them as a guest?
@SilentSerenityy i dont omg i really want to start cursing but im noat becuase of you guidelines. This is punishing guets for what only like ten percent of them did. What needs to happen here is a way to figure out how to ban the trolls. Isnt that what mods do? Warn the trolls, ban them if necessary, and leave the good people alone?
Sorry that was other me. Im DID.
I don't like connecting with listeners because they can never help me. I like the chat rooms. Now there has always been abuse in chat. What are you gonna do, take down chat entirely? I know a lot of people would leave if that happened. Im trying to stand up for guests but more 'important' people are pushing our voices away and blocking us, muting us, anyone who disagrees. Thats what happens to them.
Is this a permanent change or is it just temporary? And can I PM someone who will listen to me and take my voice into account?
prune
@sympatheticPrune6704
This isn't a punishment, it's a way to protect the listeners and moderators (and some guests too) who were receiving horrendous abuse from guests which was relentless. Trolls were warned and banned, only for them to make a new guest account with a different IP and then harass/abuse/stalk moderators/listeners to the point it caused a lot of upset and listeners weren't even able to enter the rooms. If you want someone to blame, blame the trolls for this decision.
You can use the chatrooms in your current member account and get support if you don't like connecting with listeners? The listeners are like the core of this site though.
There is a way to share your opinion in which it won't be removed/edited and that way is a respectful and polite way following the forum guidelines. There are some examples of comments like that in this thread.
This is just a step to try and solve the abuse issue, which is explained in the linked thread by Heather, in the post at the top. It's likely not a permanent solution.
You could PM Laura or Heather, I'm sure they could help you out.
I can guarantee that guests have access to therapists when they press the "Start Therapy" button at the top. Listeners can send them self help guides that they can access. You can click on the "currently trending" hashtags to get access to some of the feed. Pressing "community" at the bottom of the page will take you to the forums and subcommunities.
I'm sure someone has two minutes to quickly make a member account but if they don't have two minutes to spare, they can come back later when they do have time. I can assure you that 7 Cups doesn't spam and you can change any notifications in your settings so you receive no e-mails at all, which is available on nearly every website. Also, you won't get "spammed" with any notifications if you use a fake e-mail address.
If we got rid of guests entirely, then that would mean everyone would have to make a member account to even access the website, which would prevent those who need support from listeners getting that support quickly with a listener/therapist and would go entirely against your point. Every website allows "guests" and offers part of the website to them, but every website requires you to make an account with them to get full access to everything. 7 Cups is no different, except it offers a lot already for those really in need to talk with someone without a member account.
@SilentSerenityy I'm really confused how you can guarantee that guests have access to therapists. Many of the features are awkward to access for guests (like the forums) and some things like therapy is not available to guests. Have you tried it? I just did and I was prompted to become a member to continue.
@AffyAvo
I did try it all and you have access to everything. I got the therapy bot when I requested a therapist, which means you have access to start therapy. I believed you could have the three day trial as a guest though?
When it involves money, it would make sense to have to make a member account as you will have to give your card details to pay for therapy.
@SilentSerenityy One can connect to Sophia but I couldn't even get as far as the prompt to give my credit card/paypal details. That information has to be given before starting the 3 day trial, and I have tested that out with my account. This information has also been stated in the Support FAQ:
I thought this was a free trial. Why was my card charged?
If you signed up for therapy on 7 Cups, and your trial period has not ended, your card has not been charged. We had many people signing up that had no intention of paying us later when payment was required. As you can understand, this wasnt great for therapists as they expected payment. We now pre-authorize all cards. Per our terms, when you start a new subscription, your card is authorized for the amount of the first payment at the time of signup and we release that authorization after we verify that the funds exist. Some banks may show this as a charge in your register, but it is not. Your bank should reflect that those funds are released as soon as they can, however, some banks take longer than others.
Connecting to a bot is not the same as connecting to a therapist.
@SilentSerenityy As far as I know. therapy is not available for guests. They need to have a member account so they can actually reconnect with the therapist, their progress gets saved and there is an account that is linked to their payment, and email address for contact, because of the payment contract. Maybe @LaraG can shed some light on this.
@SilentSerenityywell i tested. THERAPY DOES NOT WORK. it just asks you to make a member account. Test it yourself if you dont believe me.badgelocked the guest rooms? Like make special one for guest and give it to nice guest?
@sympatheticPrune6704
We can't pick and choose guest access and know who's nice and who's harmful to the community.
@SilentSerenityy guests dont have access to: forums, feed, self help guides, subcommunities and therapists. You have to make a member account to get all these. I know because i tried and almost nothing worked. All the listeners i tried didnt respond or were stalkers. The growth path does barely help me at all. I don't like 1-1 connection. What about people who dont have time to make accounts? Who just don't want to get pestered by te useless spam you send me? Who don't want accounts? Can't we just bring back guest support and find a way to punish the trolls, or else get rid of guests entirely because that could be a good option too.
thanks for listening to my stupid nice other me. Sorry if i butted in and said anything mean.
prune
@sympatheticPrune6704 I am sorry to hear that you are frustrated with the lack of access guests have to the site. But as you are on a member account, you actually have access to all those things you have mentioned on this account. I can understand that sometimes total anonymity is important to some, so using a guest account might make more sense during those times. Things like the feed, the group rooms, the growth path or the forums, actually mean more dedication to the support one wants to get here, and as guest accounts are randomly assigned, saving the progress or the things you have done, would mean that you'd have to have a registered account anyway. 7 Cups makes it much easier to register accounts, you do not even have to have a valid email address, so I really don't see the issue you are struggling with. You want short term support? Use a guest account. You want long term dedicated support? Register a member acocunt.
The main thing about 7 Cups is still, and will always be, 1 on 1 support with a listener. And you will always be able to get that from a guest account! If you are unhappy with the performance of a listener, you can always leave an honest review, so we can help that listener to grow and to improve their skills if needed. There are many options to choose from in the browse listener tab here , so you can find a listener you might have the right chemistry with.
As a few people in this thread already have mentioned, this is not the perfect thing. But it is the best solution right now, it is a rational and balanced solution. We want people to feel save and supported and as we can not filter out which guests are here to get support and which guests are here to cause havoc, we have to take a more balanced approach. The rooms are a lot safer now, and why should they not be as protected as the feed and forums, anyway? And by allowing guests to take a look at the group support feature, they can make an informed decision to sign up as a member, free and with no attachment, to join in the conversation.
And to your question about being muted, I want to correct @SilentSerenityy , just to make sure you are getting the right information. Mutes last 24 hours, and three mutes lead to a one year ban from the rooms. A warning lasts 6 hours, three warnings lead to a mute. So if you receive three warnings in a six hour span, you will be muted for 24 hours. We also have instant mutes for circumventing previous mutes/bans, being drunk/intoxicared and spamming. You can read up on those in our chatroom rules at the bottom of every chatroom, or check out this thread.
I hope you can see the more rational reason behind the decisions being made. We do not want to exclude anyone totally, hence the view option. But we need to keep the site safe for all participants, and the approach that has been chosen is the best option to achieve that goal, at the moment.
@MissZ
I share this vision. I was reading a book earlier about social psychology and it's hard to find a book on social psychology free of stories about marketing and succesful leadership. One of the case studies was about "Southwest Airlines". While 7 cups is not a big corporation, the story made me think about this discussion. Community's and comporations are very different but the have some fundamental similarities.
In the end, a person, a community or a corporation wants to be succesful. The story of Southwest Airlines was inspiring because the author said that the CEO based every decision on his core belief, his vision. For southwest airlines the vision was their slogan "Low fares. Nothing to hide".
The CEO used this simple model as a core foundation. Every new idea was tested against this "slogan". The author of the book gave a practical example and said that one day, a person of the marketing team came to the CEO with an brand new idea "Let's add ceasar salad to the menu..." and as always, the CEO replied by asking "In what way would adding salad help us providing low fares?". Offcourse it didn't, while the idea was not a bad idea in itself it just didn't add anything positive or at least not enough to pursue it.
I believe 7 cups has a core community vision/goal. It's not commercial, it's phylantropical. The 7 cups mission statement is simple:
"7 Cups of Tea is an on-demand emotional health and well-being service."
I believe we still are an on demand emotional health and well being service, even after the update. I even feel that we are a step closer to our core vision. In all honesty if someone would ask me "Let's add a guest chatroom" and i'd use the same strategy well... I honsetly wouldn't know how it would help us becoming a better on-demand emotional health and well-being service.
Listeners, moderators and mentors had to spend hours in guest chat just trying to make it less offensive* and since every person can only spend every passing moment doing one thing I believe the room even harmed the core value of the community. Every hour spend moderating decreases the time listeners (and in the end, mods, mentors, ambassadors, etc are listeners) could have used to offer the service we wish to provide.
I understand that "change" can trigger panic. Every time facebook changes the layout people start to rebel against the change because they perceive the change as making the community worse than it was. It's been said over and over again and I'm glad you have expressed it so well missZ; in the end 7 cups of tea still offers the same service and I can't see how anyone will be able to proof that we are not longer are an "on-demand emotional health and well-being service." .
If you are a member and you are concerned by how this will affect the future I believe only time can either verify your concern or ... in a week or two you might notice that you can still talk to listeners and get the same amount of support.
(*) I heared the guest chatroom used to be supportive a long time ago. Sadly i cannot confirm this since it must have been before I signed up.
@SilentSerenityy i am muted from the chat rooms also so I wanna access them but cant.
@sympatheticPrune6704
If you've been muted for the first time, the mute will expire in 24 hours. Then you can access the rooms again.
